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Post by jpmessiah on Jul 13, 2005 14:12:08 GMT -5
So, having gone out with plenty of women and having been mostly friends with women all my life, I just need to understand if women realize they are crazy or not. They are. I mean, they want a man who will treat them right, who will treat them like a queen, who will be there for them and support them and care for them. That's every woman's dream. So, why do most of them go out with the guy who ignores them, who treats them like shit, who would rather be with his friends than her? Why do they take back the guy who cheated on them or hit them? You women need to make up your minds. Let me learn you a lesson. Men will never change for you. The more you take them back, the more they are going to do the same things they did before, because they know you will take them back. Plus, once they cheated on you, you are going to be left wondering why they are going out late, who they are with at the moment, what they are doing and you will never enjoy the relationship, because now you expect them to cheat again. Fools!!!
Also, why do women go out with ugly guys? Sure, they may treat them good, but why not wait for a guy who is hot that will treat you good. Unfortunately, right now, I am taken, but back in the day, I would wonder why this girl was going out with this fat kid who was just disgusting and so I asked and she was like, he treats me so well, and he really cares about me. Please!!! You like being treated well and you overlook the folds in his skin and the drool on his lip, because you know he will not be looked at by another woman, so you never have to fear being cheated on or dumped. Be real!!! Stop the lies!!!
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Post by Talon Karrde on Jul 13, 2005 17:42:20 GMT -5
Spoken like a man truly in love with himself who has a great deal of growing up to do.
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Post by jpmessiah on Jul 13, 2005 20:18:29 GMT -5
Well, let's see what other people think. Can I get some comments here from men and women please? Whose right here? Women just don't know what they really want from men. They think they do, but they always go after the exact opposite.
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DrayvensCrow
Junior Member
The other half of the greatest tag team going! Just read Bad Moon Rising!
Posts: 71
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Post by DrayvensCrow on Jul 14, 2005 2:13:18 GMT -5
Spoken like a man truly in love with himself who has a great deal of growing up to do. That or someone who had their girlfriend taken from them by the "ugly rock-star type". So I guess you're saying that "The Beautiful People" should stay with each other and screw who you are actually in love with? People have no control who they fall in love with; if they did, I'd have been kicking it a supermodel all of these years! And being divorced twice, I regularly ask myself exactly what runs through women's heads sometimes.
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Post by SoBeLoVer on Jul 14, 2005 19:19:45 GMT -5
Sadly, you are right in saying some women out there have such beliefs. A few of my very close girlfriends find the need to be in relationships where the guy is a jerk. However this isn't true for all women. I know I would never date a guy who was unkind to me. When I say I want to be with a nice guy, I actually mean it (and I have a track record to prove it!). The mind of a woman might be a bit difficult to comprehend at times, but saying their all crazy might be stretching it a bit. Men have their own issues when it comes to dating women! I know waaay too many guys who have dated a girl just because they looked good. They could be rude, vain, have no personality, etc, but as long as their hot, none of that seemed to matter. Couldn't that be perceived as crazy behavior as well? I think so! ;D
oh and by the way...."ugly" people cheat too!!! I know this to be a fact! hehe
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Post by jpmessiah on Jul 14, 2005 19:53:04 GMT -5
Welcome to the madness of Jon Minners. See, if you take your feelings and express them with a little embelishment, you get a response. Welcome to the mix SoBeLover. Glad to have you aboard and welcome you to speak your mind any time. Start your own threads too. We would welcome the chance to reply to you, as well. Now, on to what everyone is saying. Let's be honest for a second. I discuss the ugly factor. Do people really walk down the block and see an ugly girl and say, "Damn, I wonder what she has to say. I wonder what she is thinking. I wonder if she would be a good girlfriend." No, no guy does that. Same for girls. When you see a fat or ugly guy, do you really go, "I wonder if he thinks I am cute?" Nope. It doesn't happen. We all look at looks first. No one should claim to be holier than thou in that regard. Now, that may change if we get to know the person, but do we really try to get to known someone we find ugly or does it usually happen in a forced matter. Sure, we may be lucky to find someone who we may have considered ugly and realize they are the most beautiful people on the inside, but there is a reason it doesn't happen for the most part. We are all vain in our own way. That's the only great thing about the Internet. The Internet is where we learn to love people for who they are first. But it still doesn't change the fact that a majority of girls go out with bad boys they think they can change. "I know he loves me. Deep down, he loves me. I know he will change eventually" Bullshit. Hate to tell you all, but it won't ever happen. Now, keep this going. Let's hear what else everyone else has to say. Can I get a girl to discuss why she likes bad boys more than nice guys? Can I get some nice guys to discuss how girls have mistreated them because they were nice to them? Come on!! It's therapeutic.
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shadowwalker
Junior Member
Gone to look for myself
Posts: 55
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Post by shadowwalker on Jul 15, 2005 0:49:51 GMT -5
Well i see your point, but, what i've come to believe is that some women DO look for the kind gentle type and they do find them, and often times these kind gentle cute guys turn out to be wolves in sheeps clothing. As soon as the women is smitten and falls for his tricks she crosses that invisible doorway and steps into a world of alcoholism, abuse (where it be verbal or phisical), mistreatment, etc.
Another thing is maybe the guy really IS gentle and kind and the perfect man, but life today in this messed up world can really bring a person down, it can harden the softest people and generally make people who once were full of life, now miserable, and that can affect a marriage or a relationship. I know i've seen it happen too many times.
But then aain you do get some women who are desperate to live a certain image, to have a certain status and if that means dating or marrying the biggest pig on earth then they will do it. THOSE women are crazy!
Also some women deceive themselves, they are too blind to see where they have taken thier lives and thus they do say
It's all how we're brought up, how society swings, how the world affects us, who we choose to associate ourselves with which in turn influences our choices and tastes.
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Post by Justine on Jul 15, 2005 9:07:09 GMT -5
I must admit, I have gone for the bad boy type before, but I learned pretty quickly. There is a certain mystique that comes with the bad boy image---a certain "He cares about nobody but himself, but I bet I can get him to care about me" challenge---it rarely works. Most times, it gets pretty ugly.
You know, maybe I'm a strange girl, but I've never been one for looks. I make friends with who I make friends with and sort out the whole attraction thing later. Perhaps it's cuz some of the most attractive people I know have been abusive or crazy or alcoholics, but I've learned by the age of 22 that looks mean about squat when you are talking about a REAL relationship---if all you are thinking about is sex and then to walk away, by all means, pick the hot one! But for a lifetime, pick the guy who affects you when you talk to him. Hot or not.
Boy am I lucky I got married to a hot one that affects me! LOL
But, as for women being crazy, some are-some are selfish chickens and jerk people around and some are desperate and sad. But then, Men are crazy too, so perhaps blanket statements are not the best...
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Post by The Eccentric on Jul 15, 2005 14:06:19 GMT -5
For starters, I don't believe that this is simply a gender issue, as we men are certainly complex characters ourselves. I do agree, however, that those of the fairer sex can sometimes drive you bonkers with their indecisiveness. Being relatively young and sort of a late bloomer, I have limited experience with the whole dating scene, but I can still attest to this. I've only had a few girlfriends, but I've had more female friends than Dick Cheney's had heart attacks, and I've shared some of my most intimate thoughts (and vice versa) with women. The problem appears to be that while females seem to know what they want, they say and do two different things. On one hand, they claim to want a guy who will treat them right and care for them. On the other hand, this doesn't stop them from not only dating jerks, but continuing to run back to them after the relationship has ended. It happens to the sweetest of girls, too; you kind of expect it from those who are shallow, but those who are your friends should know better, right? I do understand the appeal of dating a "bad boy." Whether the girl wants to -- and feels that she can -- save the guy, or she's just excited by the prospect of going out with someone dangerous, this isn't particularly far-fetched. There's a difference between a bad boy and a jerk, though, and it's entirely possible to be a nice guy with a bit of an edge. Quite a few girls are apparently unable to realize that, though, so it's essentially an "all or nothing" situation: they remain friends with the sweet guys who comfort them, while continuing to date those who treat them like shit. Not necessarily crazy, but certainly not very rational either.
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Post by jpmessiah on Jul 16, 2005 0:24:32 GMT -5
See, now that is how I am. I have one guy friend. He is my best friend. I consider him my brother. It means I trust him not to go out with my girl or any ex. I have been destroyed by supposed best friends who were guys listening to my stories about girls and when me and my girl break up, they swoop in and try to be the sweet guy based on my past stories. Is the guy wrong? You bet your sweet ass he is, but the ex is just as wrong if not more so, because she probably did it to screw over her ex. I hate you Christina. Oooh. My bad.
Anyways, so I tend to have mostly girl friends. I tell them the guy secrets and they tell me the girl secrets, but I hear them speak and I can't believe the words that come out of their mouths. My man cheated on me, but I love him and even though we broke up, I want him back one day. WHAT?!! I was friends with a girl whose man would beat her and she would come crying to me and I wanted her so bad and was there for her and what did she do; well, she kept going back out with the guy who hit her, went on one date with me and then went right back with him. How dumb can you be? He never changed and died in a car accident, running from the police. Sweet guy.
I tend to be Mr. White Knight. A girl knows she can come to me for advice. She can come to me to cry. She can come to me for help. She doesn't want to come to me for dating. And I am damn good looking too. I get a lot of girls, but strangely, not the ones I wanted. The ones I get seem to come out of nowhere and I am thankful, because they appreciate what I do for them for the most part and they are hot. Oh, thank God for them being hot. But once, just once, I wish that when I chased a girl that had everything I wanted in a woman, I got her instead of watching her go out with some bum. That would have been nice.
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Post by The Eccentric on Jul 16, 2005 14:13:48 GMT -5
But once, just once, I wish that when I chased a girl that had everything I wanted in a woman, I got her instead of watching her go out with some bum. That would have been nice. Ditto, man. The older I get, the more I find myself identifying with the narrator of Maroon 5's "She Will Be Loved." Regarding appearance, as the expression goes, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Sure, there are some people who most members of the opposite sex will tend to agree are good-looking, but different things appeal to different people. Some guys like blondes, others prefer brunettes, while others have a thing for redheads. Some folks like blue eyes, others green, brown, or hazel. But I do agree with the earlier comment that if we personally find another person attractive, we are more likely to get to know him/her better. As human beings, we almost always observe with our eyes before our other senses; that's just our nature. As far as the whole nice guys v. bad boys argument is concerned, again, I believe that it's entirely possible for girls to have the best of both worlds. I treat females with courtesy, I respect them for their minds, and I am willing to listen to whatever they have to say. This doesn't mean, however, that I'm not dangerous or edgy as well; I enjoy sex and rock 'n' roll (minus the drugs) as much as anyone. So yeah, while I'm certainly not generalizing by any means, it's been my experience that quite a few females don't seem to know what the hell they want.
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Post by jpmessiah on Jul 19, 2005 22:34:16 GMT -5
Exactly my point. Women are EVIL!!!!
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Post by condorman on Sept 8, 2005 15:43:04 GMT -5
Women do have their issues, but so do we. I have a couple of points I would like to make.
1. To the point about ugly guys with hot girls - This is an interesting topic, because it's difficult for us guys to understand. But, the situation results from one simple idea: Attraction isn't a choice. Some of you may have heard this before, but women don't feel attraction the same way men do. This isn't to say that working out and taking pride in your appearance doesn't help, because it does.. However, that only works at the begining to get your foot in the door. It's the personality and how a guy carries himself that actually goes the distance with women. A guy has to be confident, funny and actually portray that attidute in his communication.
2. Bad Boy mistique - This is really a complicated topic, because it goes back to personality. How a guy acts and carries himself. I think this is where Justine hit it on the head where she says she married a guy: "Boy am I lucky I got married to a hot one that affects me! LOL". Being distance and confident is what a bad boy is all about, it's something about him that woman can't capture and that's what makes the relationship interesting. If you think being nice to girl, sucking up to them, and being romantic is actually going to work within the first couple weeks or months of the relationship it's not. A guy has to exude confidence, have a life, and be like he can take it or leave it. That's the bad boy mistique - the key is the woman is working for the affection not the man.. If the man surrenders to soon the woman doesn't have to work for it and the woman looses interests. Please remember this is majority situation, not 100% of the time.
2. Completness - Some people have this mindset that we need to share our life with someone else to be complete. That love with another person some how makes us complete. People can believe this if they want, however it's a painful process. The fact is the vast majority of us will date and fall in love, but in most cases we will end up broken hearted and feeling like half of ourselves. I'm not saying this will happen in every instance or that we should prepare for the worst. I'm just saying we should be of the mindset it's not essential to our life. We must all realize that we are complete in and of ourselves, that we don't need anyone else to be successful in life. Granted its nice to share our lives with someone else, but it's not essential to our existence and who we are, unless we make it that way.
These are just some thoughts from my experiences and my own reading and I'm sure a lot of you will disagree.
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Post by Justine on Sept 8, 2005 15:56:58 GMT -5
I think you read my comments wrong. When I said I got a hot guy that affects me, I wasn't meaning a bad boy. I was meaning a man.
I went the bad boy route and I learned from it. We must try to learn from that and realize that it's not a great thing. We must fall for a man who affects us intellectually.
I agree with you on another point you made though. We must be able to stand up on our own two feet if we want anyone to love us.
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Post by The Eccentric on Sept 10, 2005 21:48:19 GMT -5
You bring up some good points, condorman. One comment that I find particularly interesting is "That's the bad boy mistique - the key is the woman is working for the affection not the man.." You may be on to something there, since we all tend to enjoy things more when there is some sort of challenge involved. That's just human nature; if something comes too easily for us, we're going to appreciate it less, since the best part of achieving any goal is often the pursuit itself.
That being said, I still support my earlier claim that there's a difference between a bad boy and a jerk. I do understand the appeal of dating a person who appears to be somewhat indifferent to the relationship and could essentially take or leave it, for the reasons stated above. I also believe, however, that it's possible to straddle the line between nice guy and bad boy. Again, I tend to do this myself, or at least I think I do. I project confidence when dealing with females, which wasn't always the case, but I've certainly gotten better as it in recent years as I've become more experienced. I also don't mind displaying my sensitive side, though, and I let girls know how important I consider them. That's the part that I don't quite get...why would any girl, unless she happens to be a glutton for punishment, want to date a guy who really couldn't care less about her and only keeps her around for his own satisfaction? This, in my opinion, is what distinguishes a bad boy from a jerk.
The key here is that we're talking about long-term romantic love, not lust. It's not uncommon for guys to be interested in bad girls as well, for many of the same reasons that girls are interested in bad boys. But that's really only good if you want to just have some fun for a little while, and guys tend to be pretty unpretentious about that sort of thing, not reading more into the relationship when they should. Girls, on the other hand, seem to want long-term romances with bad boys, even after it becomes painfully obvious that the guys in question aren't going to change their ways. And that's probably the one aspect of male/female relationships that I find most difficult to figure out.
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